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	<title>Comments on: not exactly&#8230;</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.huggin.net/blog/2006/06/27/not-exactly/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.huggin.net/blog/2006/06/27/not-exactly/</link>
	<description>raising loki in okie land</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jul 2008 10:56:52 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Mike Huxley</title>
		<link>http://www.huggin.net/blog/2006/06/27/not-exactly/#comment-36375</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Huxley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Jul 2006 06:20:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.huggin.net/blog/2006/06/27/not-exactly/#comment-36375</guid>
		<description>Capitalist Pigs! I spit on you, Ptew! .... I mean....um....Go America! 

:scurries off to learn the words to the Canadian National Anthem:</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Capitalist Pigs! I spit on you, Ptew! &#8230;. I mean&#8230;.um&#8230;.Go America! </p>
<p>:scurries off to learn the words to the Canadian National Anthem:</p>
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		<title>By: Carleen</title>
		<link>http://www.huggin.net/blog/2006/06/27/not-exactly/#comment-36101</link>
		<dc:creator>Carleen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jun 2006 16:46:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.huggin.net/blog/2006/06/27/not-exactly/#comment-36101</guid>
		<description>On maternal vs. medical leave...my thoughts exactly.  My maternity leave is subject to a doctors note, that is, the medical state of either me or the child.  In fact, this was the reply I got from the person explaining this to me when I asked why new mothers were given so little time.  "Well, because...you're healthy".  My health is not the point and shouldn't be used to justify maternity leave since it doesn't take into consideration the basic right a mother (and father) should have to adjust and bond with their baby before handing them off to another caretaker.  

The situation is even worse then it appears.  I'm lucky that I can even rely on the Family Medical Leave Act.  It only covers companies that have more than fifty employees.  So, if you work for a small business, they don't have to provide you with any leave.  In fact, they even have the right to fire you because you're pregnant (which actually just happened to one of my co-workers daughters).  Just take a look at the questions being posted on the Labor Law Talk forum, http://www.laborlawtalk.com/archive/index.php/f-34.html .  Maternity leave...even medical leave...turns out it's not even a right in this country...but a privalege.  Not only that, but the leave I'm getting isn't actually being given to me.  I'm merely being given permission to use all of the sick leave, vacation leave, family sick leave that I have accumulated thus far, all of which add up to exactly 6.97 weeks of leave.  So, if I did need more time off, say, if I had a c-section which takes ten weeks to recover from, then I would have to get a doctor's note, request permission for the leave, but because I don't have the leave to cover the extra time, the city will make me pay them back the premiums they pay for my medical insurance.  Apparently, this is "only fair".

There is so much contradiction in this country.  As American children, we're raised to believe that we all have equal potential, we can be who we want to be, have whatever job we want as long as we put our minds to it.  This is the American way, the dream that has defined this country for decades.  But if I choose to be a public
librarian, or devote my life to a public instituation or even if I decide to work for a small business, that dream is put in jeopardy the minute I decide
to become a parent.  Now, on the other hand, if I decide to be a lawyer or work for some kind of big company, you can bet your butt that I would have
more maternity leave available to me simply as a matter of company policy. They have the money to do that sort of thing, whereas a public library does
not.  I guess this is capitalism for you.  As I understand it, this is an idea that is meant to put us in charge of our own wealth and well being, yet, many of us end up being penalized depending on the route we choose to obtain that wealth.  So in the end, it doesn't seem like this idea of equal potential/opportunity exists.

    
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On maternal vs. medical leave&#8230;my thoughts exactly.  My maternity leave is subject to a doctors note, that is, the medical state of either me or the child.  In fact, this was the reply I got from the person explaining this to me when I asked why new mothers were given so little time.  &#8220;Well, because&#8230;you&#8217;re healthy&#8221;.  My health is not the point and shouldn&#8217;t be used to justify maternity leave since it doesn&#8217;t take into consideration the basic right a mother (and father) should have to adjust and bond with their baby before handing them off to another caretaker.  </p>
<p>The situation is even worse then it appears.  I&#8217;m lucky that I can even rely on the Family Medical Leave Act.  It only covers companies that have more than fifty employees.  So, if you work for a small business, they don&#8217;t have to provide you with any leave.  In fact, they even have the right to fire you because you&#8217;re pregnant (which actually just happened to one of my co-workers daughters).  Just take a look at the questions being posted on the Labor Law Talk forum, <a href="http://www.laborlawtalk.com/archive/index.php/f-34.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.laborlawtalk.com/archive/index.php/f-34.html</a> .  Maternity leave&#8230;even medical leave&#8230;turns out it&#8217;s not even a right in this country&#8230;but a privalege.  Not only that, but the leave I&#8217;m getting isn&#8217;t actually being given to me.  I&#8217;m merely being given permission to use all of the sick leave, vacation leave, family sick leave that I have accumulated thus far, all of which add up to exactly 6.97 weeks of leave.  So, if I did need more time off, say, if I had a c-section which takes ten weeks to recover from, then I would have to get a doctor&#8217;s note, request permission for the leave, but because I don&#8217;t have the leave to cover the extra time, the city will make me pay them back the premiums they pay for my medical insurance.  Apparently, this is &#8220;only fair&#8221;.</p>
<p>There is so much contradiction in this country.  As American children, we&#8217;re raised to believe that we all have equal potential, we can be who we want to be, have whatever job we want as long as we put our minds to it.  This is the American way, the dream that has defined this country for decades.  But if I choose to be a public<br />
librarian, or devote my life to a public instituation or even if I decide to work for a small business, that dream is put in jeopardy the minute I decide<br />
to become a parent.  Now, on the other hand, if I decide to be a lawyer or work for some kind of big company, you can bet your butt that I would have<br />
more maternity leave available to me simply as a matter of company policy. They have the money to do that sort of thing, whereas a public library does<br />
not.  I guess this is capitalism for you.  As I understand it, this is an idea that is meant to put us in charge of our own wealth and well being, yet, many of us end up being penalized depending on the route we choose to obtain that wealth.  So in the end, it doesn&#8217;t seem like this idea of equal potential/opportunity exists.</p>
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		<title>By: Big Brother</title>
		<link>http://www.huggin.net/blog/2006/06/27/not-exactly/#comment-36025</link>
		<dc:creator>Big Brother</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jun 2006 11:14:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.huggin.net/blog/2006/06/27/not-exactly/#comment-36025</guid>
		<description>Carleen I'm really sad to hear about this!  First of all, I am surprised that you only have a "medical leave" - I thought you could get "maternal leave"!  I guess not?  Medical leave for giving birth is not maternity leave - are you getting that separately?  If not, you are not getting &lt;em&gt;any&lt;/em&gt; maternal leave at all.

I think that this experience, like so many others like it that people have in our society, really shows people in a way that nothing else can:

politics matters...

It really does.  The laws which determine the rights and benefits that people get, whether in a moderately socialist society like Norway, or a more capitalist society like the United States are determined by the political powers that are selected, at least in a democracy, by its people.  For people who can afford it which system they live in turns out to be largely a matter of convenience vs. waiting lists and high taxes.  For those who cannot - the issue can be completely different.  

A Korean friend of mine, a poor artist who was studying on a very small scholarship in New York for 3 months went to the hospital for an emergency.  She had a urine test, an X-ray and a brief meeting with a doctor.  She received and needed no medicine during this whole process.  However, she was given a bill for $1400 and she won't be able to get this back on any kind of insurance.

Contrast that bill with this second story.  Last week I took Sayaka to the emergency room here in Korea, which has a national medical system (like Japan, Canada, Norway, Britain and most countries except the US), when she was pretty sick with some kind of a urinary problem, on a Sunday.  She was given care in the emergency room (doctors not available on Sundy in normal wing) and two separate additional doctor appointments over the next week (one was a follow-up),  was given various tests, an injection/IV bag of medication, 2 urine tests, a full week of medication and the total bill I think came to about $170 (which she will get back on her insurance anyways but even without insurance, it would have been affordable). 

For those who simply cannot afford expensive health insurance, or are not provided sufficient coverage from their jobs - this is a huge issue.  This is not a "lazy socialist freebees" vs. "industrious hard-working capitalists" - this is far more basic.

Now....about your maternity leave issue...

Last summer in the Norwegian election, while I was in Norway - the issue of maternity leave was a big election issue.  There was a lot of complaints that the system was not good enough (!!)

Here is my blog entry on this topic:

http://muninn.net/blog/2005/09/children-marriage-and-norwegian-politics.html

Here is the important part:&lt;blockquote&gt;I think there have been numerous changes in the law but as I understand it stands now it basically says you get 43 total weeks of 100% paid leave from work or 53 weeks of 80% paid leave. Of this, I think the mother has 9 nine of these weeks reserved for her, and the father has 5 weeks of the total reserved for him. I think you can freely divide up the rest. In contrast, in liberal Sweden there is a fully equal law reserving 60 days for each the father and mother, but provides you 80% salary for 390 days and then 60 Swedish kroner for 90 days after that.

This issue is big in this election coming in September here in Norway. Everyone but the Right party (~15% in polls) and Forward Marching Party (~20%) want to expand the reserved time for fathers and there is all sorts of talk about making the whole system more flexible so that you can take your leave well after the child is born, up until at some point while the child is in school. One reason for considering greater flexibility is that the Swedish welfare department (who I guess in this issue plays the role of the neighbor whose garden is better tended) reports that men are more likely to take paternal leave if they are allowed to do so later on in the child’s life.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

The election was won by a left-wing coalition of the Labor party, the Socialist Left party, and the agricultural center party.  Thus, these changes may have been implemented since I wrote that blog entry.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Carleen I&#8217;m really sad to hear about this!  First of all, I am surprised that you only have a &#8220;medical leave&#8221; - I thought you could get &#8220;maternal leave&#8221;!  I guess not?  Medical leave for giving birth is not maternity leave - are you getting that separately?  If not, you are not getting <em>any</em> maternal leave at all.</p>
<p>I think that this experience, like so many others like it that people have in our society, really shows people in a way that nothing else can:</p>
<p>politics matters&#8230;</p>
<p>It really does.  The laws which determine the rights and benefits that people get, whether in a moderately socialist society like Norway, or a more capitalist society like the United States are determined by the political powers that are selected, at least in a democracy, by its people.  For people who can afford it which system they live in turns out to be largely a matter of convenience vs. waiting lists and high taxes.  For those who cannot - the issue can be completely different.  </p>
<p>A Korean friend of mine, a poor artist who was studying on a very small scholarship in New York for 3 months went to the hospital for an emergency.  She had a urine test, an X-ray and a brief meeting with a doctor.  She received and needed no medicine during this whole process.  However, she was given a bill for $1400 and she won&#8217;t be able to get this back on any kind of insurance.</p>
<p>Contrast that bill with this second story.  Last week I took Sayaka to the emergency room here in Korea, which has a national medical system (like Japan, Canada, Norway, Britain and most countries except the US), when she was pretty sick with some kind of a urinary problem, on a Sunday.  She was given care in the emergency room (doctors not available on Sundy in normal wing) and two separate additional doctor appointments over the next week (one was a follow-up),  was given various tests, an injection/IV bag of medication, 2 urine tests, a full week of medication and the total bill I think came to about $170 (which she will get back on her insurance anyways but even without insurance, it would have been affordable). </p>
<p>For those who simply cannot afford expensive health insurance, or are not provided sufficient coverage from their jobs - this is a huge issue.  This is not a &#8220;lazy socialist freebees&#8221; vs. &#8220;industrious hard-working capitalists&#8221; - this is far more basic.</p>
<p>Now&#8230;.about your maternity leave issue&#8230;</p>
<p>Last summer in the Norwegian election, while I was in Norway - the issue of maternity leave was a big election issue.  There was a lot of complaints that the system was not good enough (!!)</p>
<p>Here is my blog entry on this topic:</p>
<p><a href="http://muninn.net/blog/2005/09/children-marriage-and-norwegian-politics.html" rel="nofollow">http://muninn.net/blog/2005/09/children-marriage-and-norwegian-politics.html</a></p>
<p>Here is the important part:<br />
<blockquote>I think there have been numerous changes in the law but as I understand it stands now it basically says you get 43 total weeks of 100% paid leave from work or 53 weeks of 80% paid leave. Of this, I think the mother has 9 nine of these weeks reserved for her, and the father has 5 weeks of the total reserved for him. I think you can freely divide up the rest. In contrast, in liberal Sweden there is a fully equal law reserving 60 days for each the father and mother, but provides you 80% salary for 390 days and then 60 Swedish kroner for 90 days after that.</p>
<p>This issue is big in this election coming in September here in Norway. Everyone but the Right party (~15% in polls) and Forward Marching Party (~20%) want to expand the reserved time for fathers and there is all sorts of talk about making the whole system more flexible so that you can take your leave well after the child is born, up until at some point while the child is in school. One reason for considering greater flexibility is that the Swedish welfare department (who I guess in this issue plays the role of the neighbor whose garden is better tended) reports that men are more likely to take paternal leave if they are allowed to do so later on in the child’s life.</p></blockquote>
<p>The election was won by a left-wing coalition of the Labor party, the Socialist Left party, and the agricultural center party.  Thus, these changes may have been implemented since I wrote that blog entry.</p>
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		<title>By: Carleen Huxley</title>
		<link>http://www.huggin.net/blog/2006/06/27/not-exactly/#comment-35905</link>
		<dc:creator>Carleen Huxley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jun 2006 00:15:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.huggin.net/blog/2006/06/27/not-exactly/#comment-35905</guid>
		<description>I'm lucky, at least I get maternity leave, Mike get's nothing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m lucky, at least I get maternity leave, Mike get&#8217;s nothing.</p>
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		<title>By: Mom (Lawson)</title>
		<link>http://www.huggin.net/blog/2006/06/27/not-exactly/#comment-35797</link>
		<dc:creator>Mom (Lawson)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 15:22:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.huggin.net/blog/2006/06/27/not-exactly/#comment-35797</guid>
		<description>Rule No. 1:
Things ALWAYS work themselves out!!!

And don't forget - this child will have grandparents only 10 mins away!

And a comment on your Norway rules; The new fathers also get paid maternity leave, can't remember for how long though.

Mom</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rule No. 1:<br />
Things ALWAYS work themselves out!!!</p>
<p>And don&#8217;t forget - this child will have grandparents only 10 mins away!</p>
<p>And a comment on your Norway rules; The new fathers also get paid maternity leave, can&#8217;t remember for how long though.</p>
<p>Mom</p>
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